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	<title>Comments on: Rail Rumbles In</title>
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	<link>http://sftod.com/2009/06/17/rail-rumbles-in/</link>
	<description>Coordinating architecture and movement in the San Francisco Bay Area</description>
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		<title>By: Ted King</title>
		<link>http://sftod.com/2009/06/17/rail-rumbles-in/comment-page-1/#comment-788</link>
		<dc:creator>Ted King</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Dec 2009 17:13:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sftod.com/?p=229#comment-788</guid>
		<description>Re : &quot;Mark Pritchard&quot; - Try this link :
http://www.xrg.us/missionrailroad/

I found it at this blog post :
http://missionmission.wordpress.com/2008/08/03/freight-trains-barrelling-through-the-mission/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re : &#8220;Mark Pritchard&#8221; &#8211; Try this link :<br />
<a href="http://www.xrg.us/missionrailroad/" rel="nofollow">http://www.xrg.us/missionrailroad/</a></p>
<p>I found it at this blog post :<br />
<a href="http://missionmission.wordpress.com/2008/08/03/freight-trains-barrelling-through-the-mission/" rel="nofollow">http://missionmission.wordpress.com/2008/08/03/freight-trains-barrelling-through-the-mission/</a></p>
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		<title>By: San Francisco Real Estate: &#8220;The Scoop&#8221; &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Remember Rail?: Check out this a fascinating series&#8230;</title>
		<link>http://sftod.com/2009/06/17/rail-rumbles-in/comment-page-1/#comment-102</link>
		<dc:creator>San Francisco Real Estate: &#8220;The Scoop&#8221; &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Remember Rail?: Check out this a fascinating series&#8230;</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 19:34:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sftod.com/?p=229#comment-102</guid>
		<description>[...] Check out this a fascinating series on the history of SF transit &#8212; the latest installment is about the installation of rail around Potrero Hill, as well as the now-dormant rail tunnel that connects Fisherman&#8217;s Wharf to the Marina. There&#8217;s talk about one day rehabbing the Fort Mason Tunnel, and running an E-Embarcadero streetcar line all the way up to Crissy Field. UNRELATED: Muni fare hikes and service cuts coming in the next few weeks. [SF Transit Oriented Design and Thin Green Line] [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Check out this a fascinating series on the history of SF transit &#8212; the latest installment is about the installation of rail around Potrero Hill, as well as the now-dormant rail tunnel that connects Fisherman&#8217;s Wharf to the Marina. There&#8217;s talk about one day rehabbing the Fort Mason Tunnel, and running an E-Embarcadero streetcar line all the way up to Crissy Field. UNRELATED: Muni fare hikes and service cuts coming in the next few weeks. [SF Transit Oriented Design and Thin Green Line] [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Admin</title>
		<link>http://sftod.com/2009/06/17/rail-rumbles-in/comment-page-1/#comment-94</link>
		<dc:creator>Admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Jun 2009 22:56:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sftod.com/?p=229#comment-94</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the info.  I was at an engineering firm when the Fort Mason report came back in, and it´s definitely feasible.  It would definitely require shoring up the old (unreinforced) concrete and working on the drainage too.  The real question is where to route the rest of the tracks if the F line is to be extended.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the info.  I was at an engineering firm when the Fort Mason report came back in, and it´s definitely feasible.  It would definitely require shoring up the old (unreinforced) concrete and working on the drainage too.  The real question is where to route the rest of the tracks if the F line is to be extended.</p>
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		<title>By: Liberty Hiller</title>
		<link>http://sftod.com/2009/06/17/rail-rumbles-in/comment-page-1/#comment-90</link>
		<dc:creator>Liberty Hiller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:17:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sftod.com/?p=229#comment-90</guid>
		<description>A little weak on the history, I&#039;m afraid. Here&#039;s some detail, FWIW.

SP&#039;s *original* route into The City (as shown in the ridiculously oversized map collage) was that of the old San Francisco and San Jose RR, which cut southwesterly through SOMA and the Mission to Dolores &amp; 29th (some at grade, some on viaduct), then went south through the Bernal Cut and out to San Mateo County through what is now Daly City, Colma, and South SF to Tanforan. SP took over the SF&amp;SJ around 1870, as part of its growth into &quot;The Octopus.&quot;

The Bayshore Cutoff (what we know and love as the Caltrain route) was conceived by SP&#039;s ownership early in the 20th century, and work on it was underway when the Great Quake struck. The tunnel are numbered 1-4 from Mission Bay southward; thus #1 runs from 16th to 22nd, #2 from 23rd to 25th-ish, #3 from Oakdale to Williams, and #4 from Salinas to Blanken. (I vaguely recall that there are unused bores at  2, 3, and 4. I do not know if they were ever in revenue service.)

As one poster already mentioned, the Western Pacific tunnel was a completely separate operation from SP and the Bayshore Cutoff. Then there&#039;s the Ocean Shore Railroad, which actually followed Islais Creek more closely than the SF&amp;SJ/SP route (roughly, Alemany Boulevard), but that&#039;s a story for another day.

Why not use the Fort Mason tunnel? Well, it&#039;s been abandoned for decades and would need a lot of work to bring it up to code. I&#039;d go through it on a dare, but I wouldn&#039;t dream of opening it up to free access without some serious retrofitting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A little weak on the history, I&#8217;m afraid. Here&#8217;s some detail, FWIW.</p>
<p>SP&#8217;s *original* route into The City (as shown in the ridiculously oversized map collage) was that of the old San Francisco and San Jose RR, which cut southwesterly through SOMA and the Mission to Dolores &amp; 29th (some at grade, some on viaduct), then went south through the Bernal Cut and out to San Mateo County through what is now Daly City, Colma, and South SF to Tanforan. SP took over the SF&amp;SJ around 1870, as part of its growth into &#8220;The Octopus.&#8221;</p>
<p>The Bayshore Cutoff (what we know and love as the Caltrain route) was conceived by SP&#8217;s ownership early in the 20th century, and work on it was underway when the Great Quake struck. The tunnel are numbered 1-4 from Mission Bay southward; thus #1 runs from 16th to 22nd, #2 from 23rd to 25th-ish, #3 from Oakdale to Williams, and #4 from Salinas to Blanken. (I vaguely recall that there are unused bores at  2, 3, and 4. I do not know if they were ever in revenue service.)</p>
<p>As one poster already mentioned, the Western Pacific tunnel was a completely separate operation from SP and the Bayshore Cutoff. Then there&#8217;s the Ocean Shore Railroad, which actually followed Islais Creek more closely than the SF&amp;SJ/SP route (roughly, Alemany Boulevard), but that&#8217;s a story for another day.</p>
<p>Why not use the Fort Mason tunnel? Well, it&#8217;s been abandoned for decades and would need a lot of work to bring it up to code. I&#8217;d go through it on a dare, but I wouldn&#8217;t dream of opening it up to free access without some serious retrofitting.</p>
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		<title>By: Removing and Restoring : San Francisco Transit Oriented Design</title>
		<link>http://sftod.com/2009/06/17/rail-rumbles-in/comment-page-1/#comment-84</link>
		<dc:creator>Removing and Restoring : San Francisco Transit Oriented Design</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Jun 2009 20:29:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sftod.com/?p=229#comment-84</guid>
		<description>[...] of the legacy from the railroad through the mission are the akward lot shapes.  Instead of wedging in an akward building, Juri [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] of the legacy from the railroad through the mission are the akward lot shapes.  Instead of wedging in an akward building, Juri [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Admin</title>
		<link>http://sftod.com/2009/06/17/rail-rumbles-in/comment-page-1/#comment-83</link>
		<dc:creator>Admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jun 2009 17:13:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sftod.com/?p=229#comment-83</guid>
		<description>It should work, it&#039;s just a big image.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It should work, it&#8217;s just a big image.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Pritchard</title>
		<link>http://sftod.com/2009/06/17/rail-rumbles-in/comment-page-1/#comment-80</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Pritchard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jun 2009 02:39:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sftod.com/?p=229#comment-80</guid>
		<description>The link to a map in your second-to-last paragraph is broken.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The link to a map in your second-to-last paragraph is broken.</p>
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		<title>By: Pedestrianist</title>
		<link>http://sftod.com/2009/06/17/rail-rumbles-in/comment-page-1/#comment-61</link>
		<dc:creator>Pedestrianist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 22:34:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sftod.com/?p=229#comment-61</guid>
		<description>I thought the old Western Pacific tunnel under Potrero Hill had indeed been filled in after several sink holes opened up above it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I thought the old Western Pacific tunnel under Potrero Hill had indeed been filled in after several sink holes opened up above it.</p>
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